Flipside Movie Emporium Forum Index Flipside Movie Emporium
Discussion Forums Locked & Archived for Browsing
 
 FAQFAQ   SearchSearch   MemberlistMemberlist   UsergroupsUsergroups 
 ProfileProfile   Log in to check your private messagesLog in to check your private messages   Log inLog in 

76th Academy Award Nominees!
Goto page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4  Next
 
This forum is locked: you cannot post, reply to, or edit topics.   This topic is locked: you cannot edit posts or make replies.    Flipside Movie Emporium Forum Index -> Movie Talk
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
beltmann
Studio Exec


Joined: 26 Jun 2003
Posts: 2341
Location: West Bend, WI

PostPosted: 03.02.2004 3:21 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Like Danny, most of my colleagues and friends feel that the Oscars are not the forum for political discourse, but I deeply disagree. Celebrity is a gift bestowed upon individuals, and with that gift comes a certain degree of power and a public voice. Like I said earlier, celebrities are left with a choice in how they use that voice: They can use it to hawk Pepsi, or they can use it to speak about the issues that mean something to them. How can I begrudge an individual who has convictions and uses their public status to stand up for them? Even if I may disagree with their convictions, at least they have them and that?s more than can be said for many Americans.

To believe that the Oscar show (ostensibly the crowning celebration of the power of movies) is not a forum to exchange ideas is to believe that cinema has nothing to do with ideas?as if the greatest art form ever invented should be kept separate from politics, religion, dissent, and provocation. Why should the night be reduced to glamour and glitz? Is that really what ?the movies? are all about? For me, a true celebration of the movies must acknowledge the art form?s significant power to provoke thought and compassion.

Eric
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message AIM Address
Michael Scrutchin
Studio President


Joined: 26 Jun 2003
Posts: 832
Location: Pearland, TX

PostPosted: 03.02.2004 3:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Danny Baldwin wrote:
I am firmly against voicing politics in a show about the movies


But the movie for which he won is political, so how were his remarks in any way off-topic -- especially considering that Morris' comments were directly related to his film?
_________________
Michael Scrutchin
Flipside Movie Emporium
www.flipsidearchive.com
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
Danny Baldwin
Studio Exec


Joined: 26 Jun 2003
Posts: 1354
Location: San Diego, CA

PostPosted: 03.02.2004 3:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

beltmann wrote:
Yeah, because the movies are never political, or at least never should be. How dare some people try to use art to, you know, deal with important stuff? When it comes to art, gimme some more glamour and fashion!


Let's not lie here. The Oscars are, really, no longer a place for honoring art. It's family programming that's fun and original, a prestigious whopping four hours of Hollywood. Voice it at the Independent Spirit Awards, not when half a billion people are watching, and not looking for art. But, if they wanted to make it about art, they could easily broadcast the technical categories, shorts, and docs on a cable channel during the daytime. They don't, though.
_________________
Danny Baldwin

View My Reviews
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website AIM Address Yahoo Messenger
Danny Baldwin
Studio Exec


Joined: 26 Jun 2003
Posts: 1354
Location: San Diego, CA

PostPosted: 03.02.2004 3:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Michael B. Scrutchin wrote:
But the movie for which he won is political, so how were his remarks in any way off-topic -- especially considering that Morris' comments were directly related to his film?


Not that the majority of people watching knew what The Fog of War was , in order to develop a strong political argument you need time. I don't care if a celebrity would like to speak out politically, but they should do it on The Factor instead.
_________________
Danny Baldwin

View My Reviews
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website AIM Address Yahoo Messenger
beltmann
Studio Exec


Joined: 26 Jun 2003
Posts: 2341
Location: West Bend, WI

PostPosted: 03.02.2004 5:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Danny Baldwin wrote:
Let's not lie here. The Oscars are, really, no longer a place for honoring art.


Tell that to Charlize Theron and her winning performance of intense family fun.

Danny Baldwin wrote:
It's family programming that's fun and original, a prestigious whopping four hours of Hollywood. Voice it at the Independent Spirit Awards, not when half a billion people are watching, and not looking for art.


I don't think artists should pretend what they do isn't art, just to placate the philistines who might be watching. Some families might wish the ceremony was strictly glitz, but I don't think artists should automatically capitulate to that defeatist, superficial view. Perhaps those who are offended should instead turn on the People's Choice Awards, where art really does have zero place.

Eric
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message AIM Address
beltmann
Studio Exec


Joined: 26 Jun 2003
Posts: 2341
Location: West Bend, WI

PostPosted: 03.02.2004 5:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Danny Baldwin wrote:
I don't care if a celebrity would like to speak out politically, but they should do it on The Factor instead.


So they can be pre-judged by a hostile windbag? Honestly, I agree that a forum like that might be more effective for thoughtful debate, but there's nothing wrong with using the Oscars to initiate debate, or to disseminate new ideas. I have no problem with a celebrity planting seeds at the Oscars--when everyone is watching--and then watering them on The Factor. Both have an appropriate, useful purpose, I think.

Eric
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message AIM Address
Danny Baldwin
Studio Exec


Joined: 26 Jun 2003
Posts: 1354
Location: San Diego, CA

PostPosted: 03.02.2004 11:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The only reason they speak out at the Oscars is because they aren't debating anyone, meaning there is no one to prove them wrong.

And, on Theron, Monster may be grusome, but her speech on-stage wasn't.
_________________
Danny Baldwin

View My Reviews
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website AIM Address Yahoo Messenger
beltmann
Studio Exec


Joined: 26 Jun 2003
Posts: 2341
Location: West Bend, WI

PostPosted: 03.03.2004 1:40 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Danny Baldwin wrote:
The only reason they speak out at the Oscars is because they aren't debating anyone, meaning there is no one to prove them wrong.


I think that's a mighty big assumption. Especially since they know full well that, after their 30 seconds, the last word will ultimately be had by naysayers such talk show hosts, comedians, and message board posters. I'd call that bravery before I'd call it cowardice.

Eric
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message AIM Address
Danny Baldwin
Studio Exec


Joined: 26 Jun 2003
Posts: 1354
Location: San Diego, CA

PostPosted: 03.03.2004 1:47 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Let's not mistake terrible foresight for bravery.
_________________
Danny Baldwin

View My Reviews
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website AIM Address Yahoo Messenger
beltmann
Studio Exec


Joined: 26 Jun 2003
Posts: 2341
Location: West Bend, WI

PostPosted: 03.03.2004 1:47 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Danny Baldwin wrote:
And, on Theron, Monster may be grusome, but her speech on-stage wasn't.


Not sure how this is relevant. You stated that "Oscars are, really, no longer a place for honoring art" and that the ceremony should be family-friendly only. I mentioned Theron's win only to show that, sometimes, the Oscars are indeed about honoring art that has nothing to do with "family values." My point was that your perception of the ceremony might be skewed, which might account for why you bristle when people like Penn and Moore don't remain within your pre-conceived parameters of that ceremony.

I did not mention Theron to suggest anything about the kinds of speeches that should be accepted.

Eric
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message AIM Address
beltmann
Studio Exec


Joined: 26 Jun 2003
Posts: 2341
Location: West Bend, WI

PostPosted: 03.03.2004 1:49 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Danny Baldwin wrote:
Let's not mistake terrible foresight for bravery.


Again, my point was not to call it brave, but only to say that it's a mistake to assume their speaking is a form of cowardice.

Eric
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message AIM Address
Danny Baldwin
Studio Exec


Joined: 26 Jun 2003
Posts: 1354
Location: San Diego, CA

PostPosted: 03.03.2004 2:40 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I would never argue it's cowardly, but I would say it's an attempt to make an opinion easily formed and followed, however, I would hope the majority of watchers just discard their comments from memory.
_________________
Danny Baldwin

View My Reviews
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website AIM Address Yahoo Messenger
mfritschel
Cinematographer


Joined: 27 Jun 2003
Posts: 143
Location: Port Washington, WI

PostPosted: 03.04.2004 2:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Beltman Wrote

Like Danny, most of my colleagues and friends feel that the Oscars are not the forum for political discourse, but I deeply disagree. Celebrity is a gift bestowed upon individuals, and with that gift comes a certain degree of power and a public voice. Like I said earlier, celebrities are left with a choice in how they use that voice: They can use it to hawk Pepsi, or they can use it to speak about the issues that mean something to them. How can I begrudge an individual who has convictions and uses their public status to stand up for them? Even if I may disagree with their convictions, at least they have them and that?s more than can be said for many Americans.

Okay I still don't know how to do that write, could someone please explain it to me.

Upon further review of my own posting I have no disagreements with celebrities voicing their opinions of subjects or make political comments. Because if movies do anything, they should at least say something about society or make some kind of commentary. If we are not striving to constanly make ourselves better and are not willing to openly criticize, then really what's the point.

The two major strikes I have against hollywood is when actors make uneducated comments about things, which was defininetly not the case with Morris. The other being is how openly critical many of today's top actors are about the rich and how we should do more to help those who have less. One just has to wonder, whose making all the money? It's great to talk, but its even greater to do. I have far more respect for people like social workers and teachers, who are openly critical. It seems that most actors are biting the hand that feeds.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message AIM Address
beltmann
Studio Exec


Joined: 26 Jun 2003
Posts: 2341
Location: West Bend, WI

PostPosted: 03.04.2004 2:52 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

mfritschel wrote:
I have far more respect for people like social workers and teachers.


Teachers are underworked and overpaid.

Eric
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message AIM Address
beltmann
Studio Exec


Joined: 26 Jun 2003
Posts: 2341
Location: West Bend, WI

PostPosted: 03.04.2004 3:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

mfritschel wrote:
The two major strikes I have against hollywood is when actors make uneducated comments about things


Was it Ronald Reagan that said the great thing about being an American is that we have the right to be stupid?

Eric
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message AIM Address
Display posts from previous:   
This forum is locked: you cannot post, reply to, or edit topics.   This topic is locked: you cannot edit posts or make replies.    Flipside Movie Emporium Forum Index -> Movie Talk All times are GMT
Goto page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4  Next
Page 3 of 4

 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum


Powered by phpBB © 2001-2007 phpBB Group