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beltmann
Studio Exec
Joined: 26 Jun 2003
Posts: 2341
Location: West Bend, WI
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 Posted: 10.15.2003 11:41 pm Post subject: |
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| Monkeypox wrote: | | Of course, the more he casts Uma Thurman, the less I'm likely to care. |
Funny! I'm not a big Thurman fan, either.
While it's true that the characters in Tarantino films don't exactly inspire affection, I'd argue that he supplies us with other things to care about in his films, things that are not necessarily related to character.
Which film of yours did Kipp review?
Eric |
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Monkeypox
Cinematographer
Joined: 17 Jul 2003
Posts: 156
Location: TX
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| Posted: 10.16.2003 12:07 am Post subject: |
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| beltmann wrote: | | Monkeypox wrote: | | Of course, the more he casts Uma Thurman, the less I'm likely to care. |
Funny! I'm not a big Thurman fan, either.
While it's true that the characters in Tarantino films don't exactly inspire affection, I'd argue that he supplies us with other things to care about in his films, things that are not necessarily related to character.
Which film of yours did Kipp review?
Eric |
I don't necessarily care for those other things, either. I feel his cleverness is artificial... it's I Can't Believe It's Not Clever.
And if I were JRR Tolkein, I would be rolling around in my grave, waking, crawling my "corpsen shell" up through the dry earth, and making it my personal undead mission to devour the grey matter of anyone who tries to compare Kill Bill to Lord of the Rings.
Kipp reviewed The Tunnel, directed by Ramzi Abed... it was also reviewed on this site by Michael, in my other favorite review. 
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the night watchman
Studio Exec
Joined: 27 Jun 2003
Posts: 1373
Location: Dark, run-down shack by the graveyard.
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| Posted: 10.16.2003 12:18 am Post subject: |
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Artificial cleverness. There's a concept to grapple with.
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"If you're talking about censorship, and what things should be shown and what things shouldn't be shown, I've said that as an artist you have no social responsibility whatsoever."
-David Cronenberg |
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Mark Dujsik
Director
Joined: 26 Jun 2003
Posts: 212
Location: Chicago, IL
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Vic Vega
Grip
Joined: 16 Oct 2003
Posts: 2
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| Posted: 10.16.2003 6:14 pm Post subject: What's That Song? |
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| Does anybody know what the song is that plays in the scene in Kill Bill where The Bride walks up into Hattori Hanzo's attic and is checking out all of his samurai swords. It's really soft and has a female voice that sings real high, but no words. I've been trying to find out what the song is and it's not on the soundtrack. Any help would be appreciated. Thanks. |
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the night watchman
Studio Exec
Joined: 27 Jun 2003
Posts: 1373
Location: Dark, run-down shack by the graveyard.
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| Posted: 10.16.2003 7:08 pm Post subject: |
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I don't know it, but that link Michael provided in an earlier post might be of help. Also here's the page from DCNow.com with the track listing from the soundtrack. No samples yet, but they might provide them soon.
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Danny Baldwin
Studio Exec
Joined: 26 Jun 2003
Posts: 1354
Location: San Diego, CA
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| Posted: 10.17.2003 1:05 am Post subject: |
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| Mark Dujsik wrote: | Stayed up too late again to finish a review. Class in the morning (if I make it) is not going to be fun. Anyway:
Kill Bill: Vol. 1 |
Mark, not that ratings are very relevant on this board, I'm curious as to why you gave it a perfect score, but admitted that you hated the fact that it was split? Doesn't this deserve a deduction, or are you cutting it slack because it, really, wasn't up to Tarantino?
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Danny Baldwin
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filmsRpriceless
Camera Operator
Joined: 26 Jun 2003
Posts: 65
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| Posted: 10.17.2003 1:54 am Post subject: |
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[quote="Danny Baldwin"] | Mark Dujsik wrote: | | Mark, not that ratings are very relevant on this board, I'm curious as to why you gave it a perfect score, but admitted that you hated the fact that it was split? Doesn't this deserve a deduction, or are you cutting it slack because it, really, wasn't up to Tarantino? |
How is the split necessarily a flaw to the actual volume? I don't think it is, though I am frustrated myself with the split (no matter how awesome I felt the last dialogue to be).
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Danny Baldwin
Studio Exec
Joined: 26 Jun 2003
Posts: 1354
Location: San Diego, CA
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| Posted: 10.17.2003 2:04 am Post subject: |
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It is a flaw because the ending was nonconclusive, and nowhere to leave off. If this one part were the whole thing, and there wasn't a second, you would feel more empty, even. Doesn't a bad taste in one's mouth after viewing a film? Doens't the abruptness of this volume make all that's been seen before feel worthless because of the fact that it is so sudden and unnessecary?
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Danny Baldwin
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beltmann
Studio Exec
Joined: 26 Jun 2003
Posts: 2341
Location: West Bend, WI
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| Posted: 10.17.2003 3:20 am Post subject: |
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| Danny Baldwin wrote: | | It is a flaw because the ending was nonconclusive, and nowhere to leave off. |
As described in a previous post, I think that's debatable, not an obvious conclusion.
| Danny Baldwin wrote: | | If this one part were the whole thing, and there wasn't a second, you would feel more empty, even. Doesn't a bad taste in one's mouth after viewing a film? Doens't the abruptness of this volume make all that's been seen before feel worthless because of the fact that it is so sudden and unnessecary? |
No, no, and no. It seems off focus to criticize a film's narrative structure when its intentions and considerable accomplishments have little to do with narrative. The "abrupt" ending renders the rest worthless only if you are willing to overlook the movie's abstract achievements in favor of a more literal (and less rewarding, in my opinion) plot-and-character reading. Kill Bill is an abstract experiment that requires viewers to abandon the usual, middlebrow notions of what "good" storytelling must do.
Eric |
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Mark Dujsik
Director
Joined: 26 Jun 2003
Posts: 212
Location: Chicago, IL
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| Posted: 10.17.2003 5:27 am Post subject: |
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| beltmann wrote: | | It seems off focus to criticize a film's narrative structure when its intentions and considerable accomplishments have little to do with narrative. The "abrupt" ending renders the rest worthless only if you are willing to overlook the movie's abstract achievements in favor of a more literal (and less rewarding, in my opinion) plot-and-character reading. Kill Bill is an abstract experiment that requires viewers to abandon the usual, middlebrow notions of what "good" storytelling must do. |
What he said. :)
Considering the fact that the awkwardly edited "ending" of the movie is really only about three minutes of the film and the fact that Tarantino did do the best he could with it, it didn't really detract from my total enjoyment of what came before it. Unlike, say, the epilogue of Matchstick Men, which thematically and dramatically undermined everything that came before it. The split still sucks, of course, and it leaves me hanging longer than I'd like. Then again, how quickly did the time between The Matrix Reloaded and the upcoming Revolutions seem to go by?
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the night watchman
Studio Exec
Joined: 27 Jun 2003
Posts: 1373
Location: Dark, run-down shack by the graveyard.
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| Posted: 10.17.2003 6:33 am Post subject: |
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First of all, I like the break. I know I'm alone on this, but there you are. Second, yeah, Eric got it right. You know a second half is on the way, so where the division came was as good as if it had been planned. You can't judge it like a movie that ends abruptly. I haven't seenMatchstick Men, but I know what you're talking about. You, as a viewer, know that the narrative doesn't end here. It simply cannot be accepted as the "whole thing." My opinion of Kill Bill may change after Vol. 2 is released, but as a first half, damn, Vol. 1 is pretty good.
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"If you're talking about censorship, and what things should be shown and what things shouldn't be shown, I've said that as an artist you have no social responsibility whatsoever."
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Danny Baldwin
Studio Exec
Joined: 26 Jun 2003
Posts: 1354
Location: San Diego, CA
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| Posted: 10.17.2003 1:32 pm Post subject: |
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Even though I didn't like the break, Eric, that was a damn good reason.
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matt header
Studio Exec
Joined: 26 Jun 2003
Posts: 623
Location: Milwaukee, WI
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| Posted: 10.17.2003 5:24 pm Post subject: |
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A friend and I were talking yesterday about the decision to split it into two parts. Since the end of the first film is (I think) extremely well-done - the editing is awkward but in an excitingly abstract sense, and it cuts together various times really well - and very surprising, I imagined a title saying "Intermission," a break to get some popcorn/go to the bathroom, and then sit down for two more hours (essentially Volume 2). That, to me, would be the best possible option.
But I also agree that since they decided to do it this way, they could not have done it better. The shocking ending is a lot more "shocking" (even narratively, I would say) than either of the twists in, say, "The Matrix Reloaded" or "Star Wars: Attack of the Clones." |
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beltmann
Studio Exec
Joined: 26 Jun 2003
Posts: 2341
Location: West Bend, WI
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| Posted: 10.17.2003 9:49 pm Post subject: |
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| the night watchman wrote: | | First of all, I like the break. I know I'm alone on this, but there you are. |
Not alone--I too think the break works. I like Matt's notion that the current ending would be a perfect lead into an intermission (and I'm guessing that KB will eventually be shown that way), but while watching Vol 1 wrap up, I felt satisfied--I think Tarantino has taken an awkward situation and turned it into something that works. I didn't really feel that Vol. 1 concluded abruptly or awkwardly. Frankly, I'm not sure I'd want three straight hours of this stuff, anyway. We'll see in February.
Eric |
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